Friday, 4 January 2013

The chicken rice fallacy

Thanks for the readers who shared my last article on the fallacy about tax in the West - I was contemplating adding this onto the that article but I thought it was interesting enough to merit its own article. I call it, "the chicken rice fallacy". It was something I had encountered back in the 1990s when I was living in Singapore and Singaporeans are still going on and on about the chicken rice fallacy on social media today. Given that I totally love chicken rice and it is one of our national dishes, let's talk about the chicken rice fallacy today.
Back in the 1990s, I remember reading an article in the Straits Times about students opting to study locally rather than abroad - one of the justifications given by a student who opted for NUS centred around chicken rice. Not her education, not her job prospects, not her ambitions - but chicken rice. I guess she must really love chicken rice and her cravings for chicken rice must sit on top of her Marslow hierarchy of needs. She said something like, "in Singapore, I can go to the hawker centre and get chicken rice for $2.50 but in America or England, it would cost over $10, so expensive."

Now I have actually dealt with this issue in an article last year - but the bottom line is this: if you're looking for a quintessentially Singaporean dish like chicken rice or laksa in the West, of course you're going to pay more. Students in the West save money by eating what the locals eat, rather than insisting on dining out at expensive foreign restaurants. Here's a simple analogy about eating local: fruits. I love jackfruit (nangka) but it is extremely expensive in the West compared to in Singapore because it has to be flown from halfway around the world from somewhere like Thailand or Sri Lanka by air. Par contre, the jackfruit you buy at an NTUC supermarket in Singapore is inexpensive as doesn't come with several thousand air miles and a huge carbon footprint - it is probably from Malaysia.
Delicious jackfruit (nangka)

On the other hand, blackberries grow wild in England and are everywhere - parks, the woods, gardens, even by the side of the motorway. I go berry picking every autumn and can fill plastic bags full of blackberries - however, if you had cravings for blackberries in Singapore, ooh it is expensive. $$7.90 for a tiny punnet of it at Cold Storage for blackberries flown in from America, or S$7.85 for the canned version. Ouch. I can so easily turn this around and get a British expatriate to say, "in the UK, I can simply walk down any country lane and fill several plastic bags full of blackberries for free - but in Singapore, just a handful of blackberries would cost me S$7.90?! That's so expensive."
Picking wild blackberries in Somerset in the woods

The solution is simple. I enjoy jackfruit when I am in Singapore and blackberries when I am in the UK. Doing the opposite would simply mean spending a lot more money for a lot less delicious fruit and satisfaction. This is why I still find it incredible when I see Singaporeans in 2013 resorting to the 'chicken rice fallacy' when arguing about higher taxes in the West. For them, it all boils down to, "yes, but chicken rice is so much more expensive in the West." Okay, shall we talk about other things apart from chicken rice? How about buying property or buying a car?

I am guessing that reason why these Singaporeans get stuck on the chicken rice fallacy is because they simply cannot afford a car or a house in Singapore - they've never been able to dream about getting on the property ladder and are still living with their parents even as working adults. This is why they are focussing on something that they do know very well - chicken rice - and their entire argument centres around, yes you've guessed it: chicken rice.
Does your world revolve around chicken rice?

I was recently in Scotland where I spent the Christmas holidays - now here's an interesting fact for you. Scotland's population is almost the same as in Singapore: Scotland has 5.25 million whilst Singapore has 5.31 million. However, the area of Singapore is 710 km2 whilst the area of Scotland is 78,390 km2 - Singapore is very densely populated and Scotland is relatively empty, especially once you get out into the countryside. Property prices for houses in Scotland can be ridiculously cheap - you can get a cottage from £40,000 with a nice piece of land around it. For £100,000, it can be a nice bungalow with a garden. For £500,000, you can get a mansion with a sea/loch/lake view along with a huge garden (and no neighbours!). How much do you get for your money on the HDB market eh?

People like myself still choose to live in the big city - I am living in a small flat in central London because it is convenient for my work; there is a trade off between being close to where work is and moving out to the countryside in somewhere like rural Scotland where you can get a huge house for very little money. However for Singaporeans, you don't have that choice - not unless you're willing to move to somewhere like Ayer Hitam in Johor state, across the border in Malaysia. In England, it isn't uncommon for a family to settle down somewhere like Northampton where housing is relatively cheap and still only an hour's journey into London. So daddy would wake up early in the morning and go to work in London whilst the children would go to school locally in Northampton and the family can get onto the housing ladder quite easily in a place like that. Singaporeans simply don't have that option.
It is much harder for Singaporeans to get on the property ladder. 

Let's talk about cars - I have three letters for you: COE. The Certificate of Entitlement, oh yes. For those of you who insist on owning a car in Singapore, that's the price you pay. It has reached a high of S$67,000 in 2012, Whilst it is a luxury to have your own transport (not to mention a status symbol), why anyone would buy a car in Singapore is beyond me when you always have the option of renting for those occasions when you really need a car or simply taking a taxi. Now I actually am with the PAP  - it is a necessary evil because Singapore is already a very congested country and you simply have to limit the number of cars on the roads or else you will end up with epic traffic jams.

But if you do insist on having a car, go ahead but just be prepared to pay for it. As in the jackfruit and blackberries analogy, some things are cheaper in Singapore, some things are a lot more expensive in Singapore. You can't just celebrate the fact that you have cheap chicken rice whilst ignoring the spiralling costs of car ownership in Singapore. You have to take the good with the bad.
Chicken rice = good, national service = very bad

I have also done a London vs Singapore piece last year regarding the comparative costs of healthcare.  In any case, why do I get the feeling that Singaporeans are so fucking determined to hold on to every cent/penny they own? Even if you do pay less taxes and you don't mind serving 2 to 2.5 years of national service, hey, guess what? There are still some serious problems in Singapore which money cannot solve - this is evident from the fact that the moment Li Jiawei (the Singaporean star table tennis player) retired, she announces that she will be moving back to China with her family. A lot of Singaporeans reacted very negatively to her decision to leave Singapore - but can you blame her? She has a son - would any mother choose to make her son do national service in Singapore? The fact that she could have had a well paid job coaching in Singapore after her retirement didn't matter - there were other things in life that mattered more to her and no amount of money could make her want to stay in Singapore.

I was at the Museum of London Docklands recently and there was a Victorian Christmas display featuring Ebeneezer Scrooge. Scrooge was a famous hoarder of money - despite having significant personal wealth, he took more pleasure in hoarding money than perhaps spending some of that money on other around him. He epitomizes that kind of person who is miserable despite being rich - because he is obsessed with holding on to every penny that he has . His attitude reminds me of a lot of Singaporeans I have encountered who love the fact that Singapore's low-tax regime has allowed them to hold on to more of their take-home pay, CPF notwithstanding. Does that really make you happy?
Do you feel the need to hoard every penny you have? 

I have been called a socialist, even a fucking communist (over the Rohingya refugees issue). I actually don't mind paying higher taxes in the UK because a lot of these taxes are used to help those who are poor and are on low-income. I do believe that a government should tax the rich to help the poor and I am not one of those who benefit the most from this system. But guess what? I am glad I am not, because those people have a lot less than what I have to begin with. Okay, so I don't get to claim disability benefits - but guess what? I am glad I am not disabled so I am happy to be contributing towards the system which does help disabled people who live in my community.

Here's the irony, amongst my British friends, I'm considered centre-right. But in the eyes of my Singaporean friends, I am so far to the left I am considered a loony left wing communist. I suppose my somewhat relaxed attitude towards money, taxes and charity is due to the fact that I have always had the knack of making money. I have changed jobs, changed industries, moved countries, moved continents, learned new languages to cope with new challenges and guess what? It's like I have the cat's righting reflex, I have somehow always landed on my feet no matter what crazy circumstances I have thrown myself into over the years. I guess that's why I don't feel this desperate need to hold on to every penny I have because I know I can always make more money if I have to. I suppose people who don't share that same kind of confidence about making money might feel more compelled to hoard money tightly, like Scrooge.
So there you go, a lot of my attitude has been shaped by my experiences around the world and that is why I can only laugh when I see Singaporeans continue to fall for the chicken rice fallacy in this day and age. The chicken rice epitomizes something that is very familiar to Singaporeans - but are Singaporeans valuing this sentimentality too much? I fear it has - that is why so many Singaporeans use the chicken rice fallacy to justify so many things that are so very wrong with Singapore. This is why I can't believe that Singaporeans use the chicken rice fallacy to justify their happiness: does your well-being and happiness really boil down to chicken rice being widely available at S$2.50?  As much as I adore chicken rice, I see Singaporeans setting this criteria up merely to assure themselves that Singapore is the best country in the world - simply because they can walk down to their local hawker centre and get chicken rice (or laksa, char kway teow, mee rebus,  wantan noodles and other local Singaporean hawker favourites) at S$2.50.

Don't get me wrong, I am sentimental about the country where I grew up too - but I don't see any point in trying to use sentimentality to justify the problems; I am more interested in finding solutions to these problems instead. As usual, questions, comments etc - let me know what you think, leave a comment below, cheers.


31 comments:

  1. Hello Limpeh,

    You wrote that COE is a "necessary evil because Singapore is already a very congested country". While Singapore is densely populated, I think whether COE is a necessary evil is irrelevant to individuals.

    This is similar to our attitude towards NS. The PAP will always claim that NS is a necessary evil, but that is irrelevant when we make decisions (to immigrate, for example) as individuals. Unfortunately, Singaporeans are unable to stand up for our own interests, as you have pointed out in your 27 Dec 2012 post.

    Anyway, speaking of COE and cars, is it cheaper to take public transport or drive a car in London?

    As for why some Singaporeans want to "hold on to every penny", consider that you have paid for two apartments in London and are satisfied with the healthcare you get. On the other hand, many Singaporeans are struggling to pay for a HDB unit and their Medisave may not cover hefty medical bills as one ages. That's why you are more willing to give away your money.

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    1. Hi Puppet. Thank you for your comment.

      1. I think you have raised a very good point about NS. I don't think I can do that topic justice here, so if I may ask for your patience please, I will do a post for you on the issue, okay?

      2. Car vs public transport in London - it depends on your travel patterns. If your travels take you only around London, then you're better off on public transport because of the high cost of parking, congestion charge (ie. like your ERP in Singapore) and just struggling to find a place to park in the crowded city centre! I was meeting a friend at a cinema in the west end and he insisted on driving into town and ended up parking like MILES away and had to get a bus to meet me eventually and I was like, duh, why didn't you just get the bus from home? Such is driving in central London for you.

      But if you're out in the countryside, in rural areas, public transport is far more limited in such areas so those without a car are at the mercy of the limited public transport system - when I was in Scotland, I've visited towns where the public bus visits twice a a day (morning + afternoon), crikey. If you need to visit places like that or just get around the country a lot more (travelling salesman for eg.) then you are better off with a car for such longer journeys.

      3. Well, yes - a large part of my financial situation boils down to the fact that I have no dependants. I just have to take care of myself, whereas my father was a father of 3 - good grief, compared to myself, he had a big financial burden when bringing up his children. So yes that's where I can see that "hold on to every penny" mentality comes from. And that is why I caution people against stretching themselves too far financially, lest they fall into self induced poverty.

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    2. COEs may be a necessary evil, but the auction style of disbursement definitely is not.

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    3. Hello LIFT, I see that you're back from Belgium! What did you intend to say about NS (with regards to my comment on 4 Jan)?

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    4. Hiya Puppet, yes indeed I am back and desperately playing catch up after having been away so long. So yes I haven't forgotten, I will write you a reply soon!

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    5. Here you go Puppet: http://limpehft.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/dealing-with-question-of-ns-again.html

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  2. aiyoh.. chicken rice in the UK can be very cheap! :D .. if you cook it yourself! My husband and I just cooked some yesterday.
    Chicken rice mix x 2 packet (we cook a lot of rice haha!) - £1.10x2
    Whole chicken (Free range) - £5.90
    including rice.. maybe £9-£10?
    We had it for 2 days . So a chicken rice meal is about £2.50 per person!! :D

    Loving your blog by the way! :)

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    1. Hiya. My point is not so much whether one can recreate authentic tasting S'porean dishes in the UK, rather, it is about how Singaporeans hang their definition/criteria of what makes a country a good place to live on some very Singapore-centric measures, such as the availability of hawker food.

      There is good food everywhere you go in the world - but it tends to be local food that is the best. Hence in Japan, you get excellent Japanese food; in Italy, you get excellent Italian food, in Turkey, you get excellent Turkish good etc - you get the idea. My point is simply that many Singaporeans use the chicken rice fallacy to explain why life in the west is bad - ie. Singaporean food is expensive and often not very good when you try to track it down half way around the world away from Singapore...

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    2. hi ya, I do understand your point about the chicken rice fallacy. :)
      I just wanted to disprove the chicken rice thing directly! :D

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    3. Chicken rice is relatively easy to make - laksa on the other hand is impossible to recreate ...

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    4. Hi Limpeh,

      It is not that difficult to create Laksa. I live in Ottawa, Canada, and all I needed to do was buy laksa mix (http://www.asianhomegourmet.com/canada/index.php), canned coconut milk, noodles, shrimps, fish cake (Optional) and bean sprouts. And I can get all these ingredients at the Asian food aisle in Loblaws grocery store. Less than CAD12 in total and serves 4 gigantic bowls (or 8 equivalent hawker centre bowls). I'm just saying... :)

      I agree that some Singaporeans use all kinds of excuses to not venture out of Singapore, to avoid taking risks. They are not willing to get out of their "comfort" zone (but I tend to call "discomfort" zone based on their dissatisfaction with how the country is run). Life is a lot more than just eating a cheap plate of chicken rice. It is learning about other systems in the world which work and didn't work, why it did or did not work and realizing how discriminatory Singapore is as a country. How selfish some Singaporeans are and how little compassion they have. Its all about ME ME ME!

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    5. Bonsoir from Liege. Oh laksa... Checked out the only two chinese-vietnamese restaurants tonight and they both looked terrible! No asian food for me whilst I am working here, but as you said, life is so much more than eating cheap chicken rice. Work has taken me to a town in belgium without a half decent chinese restaurant but hey, I am here to WORK on an amazing project, not eat!

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  3. Hi Limpeh,
    regarding healthcare: you might want to get hold of a copy of 'The Undercover Economist' by Tim Harford. There's a chapter comparing the US, UK and Singapore healthcare system. Spoiler: he puts the Singapore system in a very good light, but of course the comparison does not take into account real life concerns like waiting time etc.

    A question that you might help me with. I'm a Singaporean studying/working in the UK and often get asked about differences in living costs. I always say that Singapore has been rated as one of the most expensive places to live in (e.g. Guardian cost of living survey 2012) but when I think about it, most of the examples I can think of are cheaper in SG, like public transport, renting a flat, groceries. So are the main things that makes Singapore a more expensive place to live in expensive assets like housing, cars along with the cost of raising kids, healthcare for dependents etc? I don't have experience with those things so maybe thats why it feels like Singapore is cheaper to live in than the UK.
    Thanks :)

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    1. Renting a flat is cheaper in Singapore? I don't think so. If you're looking at properties in zone 1 central London, then of course it is expensive lah. But the moment you go out to like zone 5 or 6 or further out, then the price drops significantly and in Scotland where I was over xmas, heck, you can get a whole country cottage for £40,000 only. It's ridiculously cheap - whereas in Singapore, you don't have the full cheap to expensive spectrum given it is a small city state.

      Maybe when you try to get onto the property ladder, or start a family, then all those things will come back and make you realize, damn my friends in the UK already own their own homes and it's a nice house with a garden whilst I am still living with my parents at the age of ___?!?!

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    2. Hey there,

      I might just want to correct some points here. Firstly let's do a like for like comparison. You mentioned about cost of rental of zone 1 vs further out. I have personally experienced renting in UK for 4+ years and I can say that even when you are outside central London (Essex with 1+hr commute to work), the cost is still relatively high (£700-900) Similarly, in Singapore, if you chose to rent a 2 bedroom apartment in Yishun (30-40mins commute away) could be done for S$1+K?

      When comparing transportation cost, that's where I have the most grouse about London's transport system. Even with Oyster card, you pay £5+ per day for a train service which has frequent delays and the occasional strikes. The joke we have in the office is that we should celebrate the day where everyone gets to work without experiencing tube delays. What's worse is when you stay further away from central city, that's where the train cost really hurts.

      Cost of fuel and electricity is higher. 1L petrol in Sg cost $2.20 (in November when I was back) vs 1L of supermarket petrol in UK cost £1.35.

      Of course some of the local food produce are cheaper in the UK. You adapt to what you live with. I'm now eating more bread and salad - to save cost and maintain a reasonable lifestyle.

      Whilst you compare the cost of a cottage in Scotland for £40K, the distance from Scotland to London is like from border of Thailand to Singapore. One could then argue that you can get a fantastic piece of property in Malaysia (equally matching size, garden etc) for cheaper than R$100K - depending on how ulu you want to go.

      Lastly I'm not sure how much you get in contact with young people in the UK and read the news here. You can read that the young are struggling to to buy property today and the rental market has gone up. In my office, we did a straw poll of the unmarried under 30s, and only 1 out of 15 of them can stay on her own. The rest struggled to afford rent.

      Of course, to be fair, in the context of the entire UK, if you are willing to move further away from city center (outside the zones) and commute 1+hr, you can get a pretty decent 3 bedroom detached house with a nice garden, garage etc for the price of a condo. Yes, I was looking at some before my company moved me.

      Cheers.

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    3. Hi Colin, I don't think your comparison of Essex vs Yishun is that fair because the rental market is hardly linear. Take zone 2 of SE London for example - that includes some nice desirable neighbourhoods like Dulwich Village and Greenwich some dangerous horrible places like Peckham and Brixton. The physical distance to central London is about the same (hence they're all in zone 2) - but it's gonna cost you a lot more to rent in a nicer neighbourhood than a nasty neighbourhood. You have to factor that into the equation, rather than just using physical distance per se.

      As for commuting - some people have jobs that tie them to central London, others don't. So not everyone has to commute, take my Welsh doctor friend for example, she works at her hospital which is nowhere near central London but is near where she works in North Wales.

      As for getting on the property ladder, it depends on what you're aiming for. The fact that you can get a cottage for £40k in Scotland is irrelevant if you have a job in central London - but if you do work in Scotland (or work from home, so u can live anywhere) then yeah that may be where you'd wanna go.

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    4. Hey there,

      True that the rental market is not linear. And yes, the comparison is very crude and simplistic. Still, I'm just sharing my personal experience of renting in the UK vs Singapore and comparing a relatively similar level of living.

      I spent a while hunting in East London (near Canary Wharf area) and even the 'horrible places' are expensive too! Makes you wonder how on earth these jobless can afford these places.

      I do earn a reasonable amount but it would be extremely difficult for my wife and myself to survive (with my net income) in London - even if we are only looking for a 1 bedroom apartment (aka pigeon hole). Even when we were staying in Essex, we only rented a small 2 bedroom apartment in an area which was not good (imagine a stabbing at our doorstep!!). We stopped dinning out weekly as it was too expensive and was cooking all our meals - hardly any Asian dishes as those were expensive. We got by...

      The point here is that city living is expensive and London (and even Birmingham for that matter) can be pretty expensive too unless you want to move out of the city.

      Agree that some people have to travel and some don't. But I'm just giving a personal account of what we pay for and the experience of train travel in the UK. I'm not sure giving the example of your friend working in North Wales is 'like for like' given that we do have people working in AMK etc and could walk to work? A like for like example would be someone working in the city and having to commute to work.

      Of course it depends on what you aim for on the property ladder. But consider this - let's take someone with median income in the UK - £21K per annum (ONS). Take home pay (after tax and NI) is £1.4K per month. An average monthly expense on transport (working in the city) is about £200 (alot more if you are outside tube map), food can amount to £120 per month. If that person rents a room (not an apartment) in the city, it would be another £500 - £900 (depending on location). This is not yet taking into account having a car or weekly entertainment and the utility bills etc. I'm taking real life examples of people I work with. Even some couples I know stay with their parents - cause renting an apartment together would take out most of their combined income. Of course they can stay outside the city and commute in - but how many would want to considering they would then spend 2+hr of their waking time on the trains (which frequently delays).

      Whilst there are strengths of working in the UK, its not a bed of roses. People who wants to come should do so with eyes wide open.

      Cheers.















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    5. Nobody said life was a bed of roses in the UK. I just wanna say that people who are earning £21k a year shouldn't be dreaming about getting on the property in a nice neighbourhood in London where the average property is like half a million pounds at least. They should be thinking about much, much cheaper areas (rural Scotland?) or at least delay getting on the property ladder until they start earning a lot more money. Such is life. Nobody said you could earn the minimum wage and still live in a big house and drive a lovely car - that's not how it works.

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    6. Hi there,

      Yup. Exactly my point! Point I was trying to make is that most people here are earning that amount of wages. £21K is the median (50th percentile), £32K would bring you to the 85th percentile. Let's use some numbers here - about 50% of economic activity in the UK is in London and about 80% occurs in the 3 main cities (London, Birmingham and Manchester). Most of the people (young or old) have to stay and work around these areas and they are not cheap. Most people have to travel to work.


      What you were doing was making a comparison of cost of living. What I was trying to say was to make comparison on a 'apples to apples' basis - cost of living in the city (forget Singapore have a 'rural' area unless you want to count Ubin). Also, most of the young here don't get on the property ladder early too.

      Cheers.

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    7. Hallo from Liege in Belgium, working here now. Let's put it this way, in Liege I saw some gorgeous houses where the rich live and some pretty grotty old flats where the poor live. The fact is in any country, if you want a nice life, live in a beautiful house, then you need to be in a good job and earning good money. There isn't a country in the world where you can have a shit job and still live like a king. Singapore however, has a problem that many countries don't have - overcrowding. The lower population density in Europe does take the pressure of some prices in the long run, can you imagine when Singapore hits 6.5 million?

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  4. Hi LIFT,

    I was in the UK recently. After about 10 days I came down with a chill and high fever. I was in a London hotel then, and asked for a doctor who would make house call. Instead, I was directed by hotel reception to go to a nearby hospital A&E (the Mark and Saint Thomas Hospital near the Waterloo tube/train station (name correct?)) for treatment as the hotel do not make arrangements for housecall for guest who has fallen ill. Well, I took the advice (I have no choice in any case as I needed to consult a doctor rather badly).

    Fortunately the A&E wasn't crowded that night and I was seen by a doctor
    within the hour. I was put on intra-venous antibiotic, my blood was taken,etc, etc.

    The point of my post is that I was wheeled into a ward roughly between
    midnight and 1 am, I believe it was an isolation ward as a precaution
    against the possibility of my having contacted a serious and infectious
    middle east bug during my flight compulsory stop to change plane at Dubai.

    The point is that I was under the impression that I was being kept under
    observation by the A&E (like in SGH Singapore A&E) and was at no time told that I was being warded. Also according to subsequent checking in the Internet on the NHS I should have been duly informed and told of the
    charges involved BEFORE being warded. I would then have the opportunity to decide whether to be warded. In any case, the info wasn't
    forthcoming even at the ward itself when my wife asked for the information (as she was mindful that there would be charges as we did not expect to receive any free treatment) at the time I was wheeled in. The nurses merely told her that I would be informed the next day.

    The impression that I was still under A&E observation was reinforced by the fact that during the few hours I was on the hospital bed in the ward, I was given just TWO paracetamol (panadol) tables at about 5 am BY THE SAME A&E male nurse who took me to the ward. I received absolutely NO other treatment beyond the 2 panadol. The next morning I told the consultant and her team on their rounds that I wanted to be discharged as I was feeling fine. The fever and chill has left me, although she told me that I needed a couple of day's stay, but she nevertheless allowed me to leave.

    The shocker was when my wife went to the hospital admin office to pay the bill before I could be discharged:she was presented with a bill of over a thousand GBP without any details for my less than a 12 hours hospital stay! When she asked for a breakdown of the bill as it is reasonable to expect, the billing officer simply told her that UNDER NHS RULE the hospital is NOT obliged to provide such details. It refused to budge even when we emailed the consultant. Subsequently a copy of the same bill was sent through my email, and guess what, the same error had remained unchanged on the hospital computer record!

    The point I want to make is that I have the impression that the Brits are soaking innocent visitors like us unfortunate enough to fall ill during a visit to the UK! We also found out subsequently that treatment in the A&E is apparently free even for overseas visitors. In any case the hospital had also refused to confirm this in its replies to us.
    We were also told in subsequent emails by the hospital that the CEO of the hospital would personally write to us to explain the issues. And that if I am still not satisfied with his reply I could always refer the matter to the Ombudsman in charge of NHS matters for mediation. That was well before Christmas 2012. However, to date, after over 3 months I am still waiting for the CEO's letter which was initially promised to reach us within a week!

    Clearly there is something SERIOUSLY wrong with how the NHS is being
    ADMINISTERED. Through your site I hope to warn foreigners visiting the UK to watch out for the NHS trap should they ever need medical attention.

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  5. Ermm... With all due respect, I'm not sure is it about the administration of NHS or is it that you have not read up about it prior to coming to the UK? Would you have travel insurance because that's what travel insurance is for. As I travel a lot, I do make sure that I am well covered by travel insurance in the event I have to receive medical attention - I buy annual multiple travel policy.

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  6. There has been a lot of fuss over the years in the UK, especially in the right wing press (e.g. the Daily Mail), about foreigners coming into the country to benefit from free medical care (exaggerated in my view) which has resulted in measures to recover these costs. Either the hospital acted in accordance with the rules, or there was a cock-up in the admin. If those were the rules, then the hospital acted correctly. If there was a cock-up, then that is unfortunate but not a matter of state policy.

    Because the NHS is not a profit-making company, most employees are not involved in charges and costings. I am a radiology consultant in the NHS, and I look after the CT scan department in my hospital, but if a foreign visitor asked me what they would have to pay for a CT scan I would have no idea, and nor would my staff.

    It is not the practice to itemise costs (even though radiology departments would like that to happen). Foreigners are treated the same as locals at the point of care by those looking after them, which is a good thing, but also explains why Gary did not get an itemised bill.

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  7. I thought I would check, just out of curiosity.

    Emergency treatment is free for foreign nationals as long as they are not admitted to hospital. http://www.nhs.uk/chq/pages/1086.aspx?categoryid=68&subcategoryid=162 .
    I also found the guidance on charges for overseas visitors, which I have not read http://www.dh.gov.uk/health/2012/10/overseas-visitors/ .

    You should appreciate that treatment of foreigners has become a bit of an issue, with articles like this in the right wing press http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2081614/The-scandal-NHSs-blank-cheque-foreign-nationals.html (for those unfamiliar with the UK press, the 'Daily Malcontent' has a long history of xenophobia; they objected to Jewish refugees during the Nazi period).

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    1. Hi guys thanks for your comments. Sorry I am not blogging as much this week as i am going out a lot with my new colleagues here in LiƩge - I just wanna add that as an expatriate working in Belgium i have sorted out all my medical insurance before stepping foot on Belgian soil - that is simply routine for me, in case i get injured or fall ill here, so i share your confusion with regards to how Gary ended up with such a big bill.

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  8. Colin and Peng Hui,

    Thanks for your comments.

    Colin, I was covered by Travel Insurance and was duly reimbursed on my return, but the issue is not that but the astronomical bill made controversial by the fact that the bill was not itemised. I are fully aware that it is expensive in the UK, but this is surely over the top made worse by the refusal to disclose information that a patient should reasonable expect.

    Some parts of my post above seems to have been truncated. The missing points are enclosed with the said paras hereunder for your info. (I kept a copy of post):

    "The shocker was when my wife went to the hospital admin office to pay the bill before I could be discharged:she was presented with a
    bill of over a thousand GBP without any details for my less than a 12 hours hospital stay! When she asked for a breakdown of the bill as it is reasonable to expect, the billing officer simply told her that UNDER NHS RULE the hospital is NOT obliged to provide such details. It refused to budge even when we emailed the consultant.

    Incidentally, my wife noticed a serious error on the computer monitor screen at the payment office - I was listed as being treated for epilepsy!!! She had to point this out before it was corrected by the staff before the document was printed and handed over. However,
    subsequently a copy of the same bill was sent through my email, and guess what, the same error had remained unchanged on the hospital
    computer record!

    The point I want to make is that I have the impression that the Brits are soaking innocent visitors like us unfortunate enough to fall ill during a visit to the UK! We also found out subsequently that treatment in the A&E is apparently free even for overseas visitors. In any case the hospital had also refused to confirm this in its replies to us."

    I am also fully aware of the situation regarding foreigners getting free treatment from the NHS through corrupt dealings with some functionaries appointed by the NHS because I watched that particular TV programme in the UK while there! The point is it is irrelevant to my case. I was fully prepared to pay and didn't expect any 'special' treatment, but even doctors I spoke later with were shocked. So my conclusion is that the malaise confronting the NHS is more than just foreigners taking advantage through less than trustworthy NHS 'functionaries'. How do you explain the error coding resulting in my being diagnosed as 'epileptic' and their obviously false promises to respond? Furthermore, I was not told of the cost BEFORE being warded. There is such a requirement in the NHS web site, so since it was not carried out, the fault seems to lie squarely with this particular hospital's administration. That is a huge problem there, IMO, although I was grateful for the medical treatment I have received. I only have praise for the medical professionals, doctors and nurses etc.

    Personally, it has been a huge disappointment as I had only positive regards for the UK up till that point.






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    1. Hi again, I am still in Belgium so a quick reply for now. Heavy snow in Brussels tonight! It made me think about what happened this morning, I had a coffee and a pastry at a mall but the lady overcharged me. I challenged her, got the manager and the manager told her to refund me the difference but she even got that wrong and refunded me too little. I saw her get a scolding from her manager! So was she trying to cheat my money or was it an honest mistake? I believe it was the latter. She was incompetent of course - but was she dishonest? I don't think so. Her manager explained, "I am sorry she is new, I am still training her." Such is the difference. No doubt you encountered incompetence that day at the hospital, sure - but were they trying to swindle you? I don't think so... Feel free to disagree.

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  9. I grew out of Singaporean food after my first 3 months in Japan, the local food here is just so much healthier and so much more satisfying. I ate more than I did in SG and yet still lost weight, and the last time I went back I put on almost 5Kgs in 2 weeks.

    Singaporeans ought to stop thinking that nothing else in the world can taste better. Hell, even the McDonald's over here tastes healthier!

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    1. Hi there. I am currently sitting in a cafe in downtown Brussels - it is minus 3 and snowing and it is so pretty with a layer of fresh snow on everything from cars, statues, trees and rooftops. I am so happy experiencing new things in Belgium that I barely think about Spore...

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    2. Well you do still write a blog about SG...

      I simply stopped following any news regarding it after a few months. Honestly made life so much more satisfying. I think it's like a break up, just gotta learn to let go.

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    3. Hi Sen Heng, let's put it this way.

      My blog is not about Singapore per se, but I react to current affairs and stories that I do have something to say about. Sometimes they are about Singapore, but other times they are either about issues I feel strongly about or a reaction to something I have experienced personally (eg. such as recently breaking a bone in my ankle).

      I can't let go of Singapore per se - it is a part of whom I am. Believe you me, I have just accepted it, it's easier that way. Working in Belgium, good grief, how many times have I got to tell this story.

      1. I am British
      2. I live in London
      3. I am (mostly) of Chinese extraction
      4. My father is from Malaysia
      5. My mother is from Singapore
      6. I was born in Singapore
      7. I speak English as a first language, French as a second language and Chinese as a third language - yes in that order, Chinese is not my mother tongue, it is not even my second language my French is so much better than my Chinese.
      8. I was educated at a British and a French university, that's why I speak French so well (which proved extremely useful in Belgium, of course).

      You get the idea - I am whom I am because of this unusual journey I took that has shaped me and people are actually interested... especially in a place like Belgium which is naturally trilingual (French-Flemish-English) and when they meet someone like me who manages 2.5 out of 3 languages (well, my Dutch is rather basic) they want to know if I have lived/studied/worked in Belgium before (no I haven't) and why I speak their languages.

      It's easier for me to sit here and talk/write/blog about Singapore as I am not there nor is my fate/future tied to whether or not the 60.14% wake the fuck up and vote the PAP out of power. But if you are still holding on to your Singaporean passport, it is perhaps less painful to look the other way from the comfort of being in another country. I have done that before, for a period of about 6.5 years - I didn't even go back to Singapore for that period.

      What has made me more happy to re-engage with Singapore is the fact that there is a community of vehemently anti-PAP voices on the internet and I enjoy interacting with them - birds of a feather and all that. In the past, looking at any news from Singapore via the Straits Times was just painful... but now we have alternative anti-PAP sources. You will see.

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