Hello guys, I'm doing a follow up on my last post to Russian people being brainwashed and it really hit home when one of my regular readers (let's refer him as Mr Zhu) turned out to be totally brainwashed as well - this time by the state-controlled media in China. Chinese is his first language thus he prefers consuming news from China in Chinese rather than struggle on in English, but that means he is only getting the Chinese government approved version of the story. I mentioned the 1989 Tiananmen massacre as well as the current genocide happening in Xinjiang and sure enough, he disagreed with me denying that neither events happened and Mr Zhu then in turn accused me of being brainwashed by the Western media. I am then faced with a difficult decision: do I get into an argument (that will presumably go nowhere) with him about which version of the story is the reality and which one is but government propaganda? Or do I simply ban him from my blog's comment section because I find him guilty of spreading fake news? I had initially went for compromise solution: I approved his original comment but told him that he was wrong - I did that because I wanted to demonstrate that brainwashed people are everywhere, even amongst my readers. Then my reader Sandra requested that I delete that comment for Mr Zhu was spreading fake news and that we really ought to take a stance against it. Well, she convinced me that it was the right thing to do as I wasn't prepared to spend that much time and energy trying to convince Mr Zhu that he was wrong given that he was adamant that he was right and I was totally wrong - he then even left a few more really long comments in both English and Chinese, which I have all just deleted. So Sandra and I are left in our echo chamber where we can agree with each other all day long but was that the right thing to do in this situation?
Allow me to compare this to the fruitless negotiations that are going on between Russia and Ukraine at the moment: I just don't see how it is going to end the war if Russia's conditions for stopping all the killing include a complete, unconditional surrender by the Ukrainians, for the Ukrainians to give up their democratically elected government and to accept either a puppet government which will do Putin's bidding or even accept direct rule from Moscow. Under such conditions, I don't think any good would come out of such negotiations and if they get Russia to agree to some humanitarian corridors to allow civilians to escape the worst hit areas, then that's already a good thing. By the same token, Mr Zhu is essentially demanding that I admit that I'm completely wrong, that I've been completely brainwashed by Western media all my life and that his version of events like the Tiananmen massacre and the Uighur genocide is the truth - if I accept his terms, then he will continue reading my blog, if not then he will stop reading my blog and he might tell others to boycott my blog. Now you know why I am comparing this 'negotiation' to the talks happening between Russia and Ukraine at the moment - let's be clear, Mr Zhu isn't interested in hearing what I have to say about the issue. He is offering me an ultimatum: either you believe what I tell you and admit you're wrong or you will lose me as a reader. Hence it was under such circumstances, that I chose to tell him never to come back to my blog again and that all his future comments will be deleted. You simply can't try to argue or reason with someone who has no intention in even starting that process with you: Ukraine cannot just walk away from this war with Russia but in contrast I have the luxury of simply blocking Mr Zhu.
Allow me to contrast this to the kind of interactions I have with another reader Sandra: she and I share a lot in common. After all, we are both from Singapore, we are both married to British guys and we both live in North London. We both studied in the UK and thus we both know what it is like to adjust to life in the UK after having grown up in Singapore. In fact, I think she probably lives about 8 km away from me, not far away at all. Nonetheless, Sandra and I don't always agree on many issues but what often follows is a frank and honest exchange of opinions - I am interested in what she has to say and in return, she listens to what I have to say on the issue. I am not convinced that I can change her mind on the issue if we happen to disagree, but all I want to do is to make her aware of how others may have a different perspective on that issue and for her to take those other perspectives into account, that's all. I think both Sandra and I are both aware of the fact that we are probably never going to win any arguments with the "I'm 100% right and you're 100% wrong" approach - that's why we're quite happy to agree to disagree whilst hearing the other party's opinion in a respectful manner. If Mr Zhu wanted to challenge my perception that the Chinese communist party was downright evil, then he could have tried Sandra's approach and then I would have been happy to discuss the issue with him. But no, he didn't go down that route and thus I felt like I had very little to gain from any further interactions with him if that was his stance, he wasn't willing to engage me, he wanted to lecture me so trying to engage him was not going to be easy at all.
Now is this simply a question of poor social skills on the part of Mr Zhu? Quite possibly. In a recent post, I talked about two people (my father and a former colleague) who had terrible social skills - so even in circumstances when they were right and had a very valid argument, they were so abrasive in the way they presented their argument that most people just didn't want to listen to them; or at the very least, they would be so distracted by their poor social skills that any reason to do with the argument would have been lost in the process. Admittedly, Mr Zhu is trying to express himself in his second language English and his first language is Chinese - now believe me, I do want to be sympathetic here. I am currently dealing with a client in Peru at the moment and all our communication has been done entirely in Spanish which is my fourth language (after English, French and Mandarin). Sometimes the client would leave me a voice note on Whatsapp and it's not even like an email I can just bung into Google translate, she would speak so quickly that I struggle to understand every word and I worry that I may miss out something very important if I didn't understand everything she said. So yes, I know exactly what the challenges are when it comes to a social or business interaction which are not conducted in your mother tongue/first language. And to be fair to Mr Zhu, he wasn't rude or aggressive or anything like that - no, it just that he didn't demonstrate any interest to engage me as an equal - it is important to be polite of course but that's not the same as being persuasive. So whilst Mr Zhu was polite but didn't know how to present a cogent, persuasive argument at all. It is so much harder to be persuasive than to be polite and he doesn't realizes the difference.
Another reason why any kind of discussion with Mr Zhu is going to be problematic is the Dunning Kruger effect: Mr Zhu is oblivious to the fact that he doesn't have the skills to persuade someone like me to change my mind and accept his point of view. There's a huge difference between him simply telling me what he thinks and him being able to get me to change my mind on the issue - I accept that there are people like him in East Asia who accept the Chinese Communist Party's version of events, the same way there are many millions of Russians at the moment who believe Putin's version of events about why they are at war with Ukraine at the moment. However, what Mr Zhu doesn't seem to realize is that just because he accepts the Chinese government's version of events doesn't mean that I would just take the same default stance: we need to start with the languages we consume our news in. Mr Zhu primarily consumes his news in Chinese whereas for someone like me who speaks 25 languages, I consume my news from a whole range of sources, from different countries, in different languages. How we respond to the news is also hugely influenced by our education and our life experiences; needless to say, Mr Zhu and I are very different people in this aspect. There is a safety announcement that we often hear on the London Underground: 'mind the gap between the train and the platform'. The version in Singapore is 'mind the platform gap'. In this case, Mr Zhu needs to mind the gap and he is clearly oblivious to the massive gulf between his perception of the world and mine, so how am I even supposed to begin to engage someone like that when he isn't even aware of the gap? Is he oblivious to the fact that my point of view will be different?
I wonder if any of my readers is going to turn around and berate me for missing this opportunity to try to engage Mr Zhu on the issue - could I have at least opened his eyes to the other side of the story? The song 'A Whole New World' comes to mind, should my mission be to bring this whole new world to Mr Zhu if he is already a regular reader and there is clearly a gap in his knowledge? This then begs the next question: whose responsibility is it to educate Mr Zhu then? Should it be his parents? His teachers at school and university? His colleagues and employers? Or Mr Zhu himself? This is a rhetorical question of course: Mr Zhu needs to be responsible for educating himself and if there are gaps in his knowledge, then it is not my responsibility to try to fix the problem. I can't possibly fix every gap in his knowledge via my blog - that was never the intention nor purpose of my blog. Only he can decide if he wishes to do anything about the gaps in his knowledge. Furthermore, you know the saying, "you can bring a horse to water but you can't make it drink." It is one thing offering Mr Zhu an explanation on a topic like "why do ordinary Russians support Putin's war in Ukraine" but realistically, that's as far as I would go - the blog post is the water, whether or not the horse chooses to drink it is the horse's choice at the end of the day. If it had been someone closer to me like my nephew who has such a massive gap in his knowledge, then yeah, I might feel a lot more obliged and motivated to try to do something to rectify that situation. But if this is a reader in Macau whom I am highly unlikely to ever meet then I can choose to just walk away from the problem.
There has been a report in the news about how Russian speaking volunteers in various countries like Lithuania, Estonia and Latvia have been cold calling Russian people to try to engage them in a conversation about the war in Ukraine, in a desperate bid to try to get them to look beyond the Russian government's propaganda. It is a valiant undertaking of course but I feel for the volunteers who are having a really hard time. Most Russian people just hang up on them and don't want to talk about it, whilst others simply echo what the lies have been fed by the Russian media. I have mixed feelings about this: on one hand, sure I want to encourage the volunteers who are doing everything they can to help end the war in Ukraine. These people can't go fight on the front line in Ukraine so they are doing what they can by engaging Russian people through the phone lines. But on the other hand, it must feel like you're trying to drain a lake with a teaspoon. So even if you are engaging people on the matter, you lift your eyes and look across the lake, it can feel like you've not made any difference at all given how much water there is in that lake! Then you realize, even if I lived a thousand years and kept on doing this everyday for a thousand years, I would still never ever empty that lake with just a little teaspoon. This is just mission impossible - how the hell am I supposed to ever succeed in this process? Thus hypothetically speaking, let's say I somehow manage to change Mr Zhu's mind on the issue, what real difference does that make when there are so many millions of other Chinese people who are completely brainwashed by the Chinese Community Party? That would be just me having taken one teaspoon of water out of a massive lake, so even if you have accomplished something that's remarkable, in the end, it doesn't really make any difference at all and that is depressing.
So there you go, that's it from me on this issue. Would you have tried to engage Mr Zhu on this occasion or not? Am I simply creating my own echo chamber by choosing not to engage him or am I being sensible in picking my battles? What kind of attitudes have you encountered in recent days when it comes to talking about the invasion of Ukraine? Have you encountered very misinformed or brainwashed people? Please do leave a comment below and many thanks for reading.
There's no point engaging with morons. Why give them a platform to air their misinformation? You are not a news media trying to show neutrality. Trump supporters, pro-communist Chinese, Russian trolls, Q-anon, etc., are all using different platforms to spread rubbish. Don't even give them the time of day.
ReplyDeleteHi there Di. Oh you'll be amazed how many replies/comments from others like Mr Zhu I have received and I have taken the choice not to engage them. Basically, they're like "I demand that you convince me that Western media is correct and Chinese media is wrong. You think you're so smart, go on then, convince me that you're right and that I ought to listen to you." And I'm like, who the hell do you think you are? You're a complete stranger - an anonymous one at that, why should I spend any time and energy convincing you that you ought to listen to me? I have 11.6 million views on my blog already, I have plenty of readers flocking to my blog everyday, what makes you think you're more special than everyone else?
DeleteI think it's just a rather childish way of responding by saying, "I refuse to believe you that Western media is right and Chinese media is wrong - what are you gonna do about it? I demand you convince me!" I note that these people made ZERO effort to try to convince me that Western media is wrong and that I should get my news from Chinese media instead given that I do speak Mandarin fluently. There is a complete lack of social skills in terms of figuring out how to engage me - I can only shake my head in this situation and say, "if you don't know how to engage people online, then we're not having this conversation. Go away. Don't come back."
Actually I didn't even tell them that because they want my attention - I have the option of deleting the comment (instead of approving it) so I nip it in the bud, I don't talk to them at all even if they are spoiling for a fight with me here.
DeleteHi Sandra and thanks for following up with me here! Interestingly enough there was a huge spike in traffic to these two latest articles in the last 24 hours so clearly this is a topic that people do want to talk about. But you're totally right, I think it goes beyond having good social skills - you've hit the nail on the head when you talked about the difference between being entitled to your own opinion and your own facts. At least your father is clearly competent in English and is able to access news in English but my father is primarily Mandarin speaking and consumes his news only in Mandarin so he mainly consumes the local papers + the 24 hours CCTV China news station on TV. You can only imagine just how utterly brainwashed my father is and I'm like yeah whatever, he's so old it doesn't matter what he thinks, nobody cares what his opinion is anyway not even his own children care what he has to say. That's how I cope with it.
ReplyDeleteI think a lot of Singaporean Chinese people like your father tend to hide behind the issue of racism - like if a Chinese, HK or Singaporean immigrant fails to make it in the UK, then you blame the Angmohs for racism rather than critically examining if the fault actually lies with the individual. The streets of London (or Reading) are not paved with gold and I've had to work hard to prove myself in my industry to get to where I am today. My father once said something so fucking hideous it only shows how ignorant and fucking retarded he is: once I got a good job and he had the audacity to say, "Angmoh give you chance" - and I'm like, I'm not some sympathy case, I'm not a box to be ticked in the name of diversity, I earn my place at the table by proving that I'm a competent, intelligent and resourceful professional who excels at his job. How dare you imply that I got this good job through anything but my merit? The fact is my father is such a pathetic fucking loser he has made a habit of blaming others for his own failures in life and he would never ever take responsibility for anything - he was a shit father because he never took any responsibility to be a father. So for him to see me take responsibility for my own career and well being in the West, well it confuses the heck out of him to say the least.
Anyway, even if it means creating our own little echo chamber here Sandra, it is always a relief talking to you because we validate each other's feelings on the matter when people like Mr Zhu and our fathers drive us up the wall with their ignorance.
I recently read about a recent case of chained women in Xuzhou, China whom is a victim of human trafficking. It really angered me and I had shared that article to a friend of mine who is a CCP supporter, as I wanted him to see that CCP is evil.
ReplyDeleteHis reply is that it is the local officials who are corrupt, not the leadership of CCP.
I feel so sad that despite irrefutable evidence, he can still blame it on the local officials and not the CCP as a whole. He cannot accept that the whole system is corrupt.
Another common objections by CCP supporters when presented by irrefutable evidence, they will say it is fake news, generated by "forces outside of China" who wanted to see China fall.
ReplyDeleteWell, having worked with a lot of people from China before, allow me to explain why they are so defensive and buy into the narrative that the CCP is perfect. They are terrified of non-Chinese people (including Singaporeans) of looking down on China and Chinese people, there is no smoke without fire. China was an awfully poor country in the 1970s and 1980s and whilst there has been incredibly economic development in the last 30 years, the wealth is very unevenly distributed so there are still a lot of terribly poor people in China today. Hence it is a chip on their shoulders, this constant fear of people looking down on them. Ironically, the poorer and more insecure they are, the more blindly loyal they are to the system. I've worked with seriously crazy rich Chinese people who can laugh at how fucked up the CCP is but shrug it off with a smile and a laugh because they're not dependent on the CCP for anything when they're that insanely rich.
DeleteYes, the "little pink party". I pity them, really. I believe most of them know they are in a very bad situation as when given a chance to live in the west which they so despair, most will jump at the chance.
DeleteWell you can look forward to the next post then - I shall revisit the issue of moving abroad for greener pastures but from a different angle, someone asked me a weird question on one of my old posts and I was like, you're asking the wrong question. I felt so strongly about the issue that I've turned it into my next post so watch out for it soon.
DeleteI was going to write something really scathing about the kind of people you've just described but I fear it's just me once again telling the world I think my father is a pathetic loser so in the name of self-censorship, I will spare you that rant. I hope you enjoy your break in Singapore.
ReplyDelete